Reading this forum you would think Bush is very unpopular with a vast majority of the American people, is so incompetent that he accomplishes nothing, and is on the verge of impending impeachment. But that is not reality. The reality is that he is much more popular than most people here think, despite the polls that certainly are not reflected in my state. He is accomplishing his goals, the most significant of which is shaping the Supreme Court and moving it to the right. And no, he will never be impeached, despite all the wishful thinking in the world here. Bush is winning and we, for all our criticism of him, are left with nothing.
That's the reality, which is very far from the message one gets from reading many of the posts on this forum of a failed Presidency that is doomed to go down in defeat. My Ass!
The purpose of this poll is not to be negative, which I will surely be accused of. The purpose of this poll is to wake some people the fuck up.
p.s. Feel free to launch all the arrows my way that you want for telling you something you do not want to recognize.
Full Version: Is Bush Winning?
OLD American Century / White Rose Society message boards > Political Discussion forums > POLLS/SURVEYS
Oh no... Sky is going to go nuts again 
I think he is. He is doing what he wants, and cannot be touched. He has attacked nearly every aspect of democracy, and there are no reprocussions in sight.
What can happen to him? Sweet FA.
Bush wins.
But, we need to prepare for what is next. You guys need to shift your country back to the left, and take it away from the PNAC.
I think he is. He is doing what he wants, and cannot be touched. He has attacked nearly every aspect of democracy, and there are no reprocussions in sight.
What can happen to him? Sweet FA.
Bush wins.
But, we need to prepare for what is next. You guys need to shift your country back to the left, and take it away from the PNAC.
QUOTE(rcorporon @ Wednesday, 25 January 2006, 10:45 pm) [snapback]41200[/snapback]
Oh no... Sky is going to go nuts again
I think he is. He is doing what he wants, and cannot be touched. He has attacked nearly every aspect of democracy, and there are no reprocussions in sight.
What can happen to him? Sweet FA.
Bush wins.
But, we need to prepare for what is next. You guys need to shift your country back to the left, and take it away from the PNAC.
I went nuts already.
You didn't hear me then, you won't hear me now!
So I see no reason to bother!
He is unpopular. THe latest Zogby poll (Jan 15) puts his approval rating at 39%. Not that it matters, because he has all the power firmly in his hands, and has no reason to care what the people think of him.
I WANT a parliament, and I WANT a no-confidence vote mechanism!!!!!!
I WANT a parliament, and I WANT a no-confidence vote mechanism!!!!!!
QUOTE(Pinget @ Friday, 27 January 2006, 1:28 am) [snapback]41226[/snapback]
He is unpopular. THe latest Zogby poll (Jan 15) puts his approval rating at 39%. Not that it matters, because he has all the power firmly in his hands, and has no reason to care what the people think of him.
I WANT a parliament, and I WANT a no-confidence vote mechanism!!!!!!
Careful Ping, sky may drop some "f" bombs your way with talk like that.
QUOTE(rcorporon @ Thursday, 26 January 2006, 6:20 pm) [snapback]41332[/snapback]
Careful Ping, sky may drop some "f" bombs your way with talk like that.
It's true! I might!
But not because you think I might!
If the people of America want to change the system,
then the system will change.
If the people of America do not wish to change the system,
that doesn't mean the system is broken.
In fact, it means it is not!
I rather like the idea of the no confidence vote.
(assumeing there is not voter fraud to worry about)
This would be something neither side could take advantage of.
The congress could call for the vote,
but it's the people who would do the actual voting!
Bush? He'd be out the day after the vote!
Clinton? Would have survived easy!
Question:
Honest evaluation, what could the possible negative aspects of such a change in the American system be?
How could it maybe come back to bite us in the ass?
Recall how DeLay insisted and pushed for legislative redistricting in Texas, in the hopes of making a stronger Republican party, and how that has now come back to all but guarantee he won't be reelected!
QUOTE(sky of mind @ Friday, 27 January 2006, 2:24 am) [snapback]41395[/snapback]
It's true! I might!...
I won't get any f bombs
this time sky, I promise! BUSH IS A LOSER AND LOSING RAPIDLY 
I live in a very red county in a red state and I know Republicans that cannot stand Bush. Look at me, I'm pro-life and I cannot stand him! It's true, the American people are as naive as the Europeans know us to be, but Bush has done enuf lies and evil maneuvers in America and throughout the world to wake up MOST Americans... and the others are on the fence and questioning things in their minds. There is a very small minority that will never change their mind , and they are not Republican, they are ignorant Neanderthals.I believe sites like POAC have given us the tools to articulate the truth more than we realize ... I know I have been able to educate and persuade people to wake up and smell the coffee both on and off the net, and like Oprah would say, I feel empowered!
F bombs!
A new bit of termanology.
I feel somehow honored!
Yank. I have zero doubt that what you say is correct!
This is reflected by every national poll.
I have seen the same effect in my corner of the world as well.
People who used to be the loudest freeper republicans,
are these days especially quiet!
A new bit of termanology.
I feel somehow honored!
Yank. I have zero doubt that what you say is correct!
This is reflected by every national poll.
I have seen the same effect in my corner of the world as well.
People who used to be the loudest freeper republicans,
are these days especially quiet!
I think its important to distinguish between what I believe (and want to believe) and what I perceive is 'reality' (outside of myself). I think that distinction gets lost many times on this forum, when people confuse what they want to believe with 'reality'. That's not hanging my head in defeat, whining, complaining, and giving up. That is recognizing 'reality' and dealing with the true nature of the problem instead of an illusion. That is why I think its totally insane to be talking about impeachment in the current political environment. Some people here need a hard 'reality check'.
Before we impeach or do anything drastic like that, we need to take action and inform. Not just letters and postings, but going out in our own little communities and dealing with local problems and fixing it at the base. There is no since is attacking the man on the top of the pile when there will be another one to take his place. Maybe its because I am a teacher that I think Educating the people is our best weapon against those who wish to control us.
What do you suggest we do after this reality check?
What do you suggest we do after this reality check?
I may be grabbing CupO'Joe's thunder by posting his topic of the day in this thread, but here it is. I think it's appropriate for it to go here because it seems to address things that all of us may have failed to notice:
Link: http://tvnewslies.org/phpbb/viewtopic.php?t=2867
Catherine
QUOTE
This is a transcript of Joe Vecchio's daily "Cup O' Joe Report" podcast, availaible via "screaming audio" here and posted with the permission of the author.
Since so many people harp on me for being "negative" and only talking about how lousy things are, I thought I'd let people know about the good things that are happening. Because, believe it or not, good things are happening.
First, there's Al Gore, who continues to speak out on important issues in a way that's making him hard to ignore. Some are even calling on him to run for President again.
Second, as I speak, Senator John Kerry, along with Senator Ted Kennedy and Minority Leader Harry Reid, are leading a filibuster to try to prevent Judge Sam Alito from sitting on the Supreme Court. Whether they can hold the filibuster or not remains to be seen, but I think it's significant that they're willing to stand up and fight for this.
And then there's Gov. Howard Dean, chairman of the Democratic National Committee. He was on the Today show this week where host Katie Couric tried to push the Republican lie that Jack Abramoff gave money to Democrats. Dean would have none of it, and stood his ground firmly.
Gore, Kerry, and Dean have taken a lot of criticism for their election loses, but the truth is that every Democrat running for national office faces a huge uphill battle: not only do they have to go up against a well-paid, well-oiled Republican propaganda machine, they also have to go up against the so-called "professional" media that's clearly against Democrats and liberals. Those are some pretty formidable obstacles. True, we still have a long way to go, but a journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step, and I believe we're headed in the right direction.....
Joe Vecchio is a proud member of the The White Rose Society!
Since so many people harp on me for being "negative" and only talking about how lousy things are, I thought I'd let people know about the good things that are happening. Because, believe it or not, good things are happening.
First, there's Al Gore, who continues to speak out on important issues in a way that's making him hard to ignore. Some are even calling on him to run for President again.
Second, as I speak, Senator John Kerry, along with Senator Ted Kennedy and Minority Leader Harry Reid, are leading a filibuster to try to prevent Judge Sam Alito from sitting on the Supreme Court. Whether they can hold the filibuster or not remains to be seen, but I think it's significant that they're willing to stand up and fight for this.
And then there's Gov. Howard Dean, chairman of the Democratic National Committee. He was on the Today show this week where host Katie Couric tried to push the Republican lie that Jack Abramoff gave money to Democrats. Dean would have none of it, and stood his ground firmly.
Gore, Kerry, and Dean have taken a lot of criticism for their election loses, but the truth is that every Democrat running for national office faces a huge uphill battle: not only do they have to go up against a well-paid, well-oiled Republican propaganda machine, they also have to go up against the so-called "professional" media that's clearly against Democrats and liberals. Those are some pretty formidable obstacles. True, we still have a long way to go, but a journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step, and I believe we're headed in the right direction.....
Joe Vecchio is a proud member of the The White Rose Society!
Link: http://tvnewslies.org/phpbb/viewtopic.php?t=2867
Catherine
Please allow me to disagree. Quoting a friend........
Bush, the man, is not winning. The corporate-run system is. Why focus on the man and disregard the real culprits ?
Thanks for the smoke screen, all the same.
QUOTE
The definitive book on the two-party (one-party) system, IMO, is "Indispensable Enemies" by the late Walter Karp.
Another good one, once you've read Karp, is "Dime's Worth of Difference," by Alexander Cockburn and Jeffrey St. Clair, which updates the story with recent facts. An excellent example they give is how the neo-con/Trilateral/PNAC agenda continued to be advanced during the Clinton administration.
What it boils down to is that the Democrats and Republicans need each other to stay in power, and both are dedicated to eliminating any real political opposition.
Since both parties are beholden to big corporations, they prefer the present form of government in the U.S. where government operates for the benefit of corporations and corporations dictate what government should do. This is exactly the form of government that Mussolini defined as fascist, even though AOL just deleted a post of mine that said so.
The Democrats and the Republicans dine at the same trough and neither will ever present any impedence to corporate rule.
Ralph Nader is the greatest anti-corporate crusader the U.S. has ever known. Both Republicans and Democrats joined forces to deny him the right to take part in public debates, to smear him, and to keep him off the ballot wherever possible in the 2000 and 2004 Presidential elections. On the large pro-Democratic forums, nobody is more hated and vilified than Nader--Bush and Cheney don't even come close.
In the U.S. we have a government of the corporations, by the corporations, and for the corporations. Corporations have more rights than citizens, in that they are legally persons but do not have the responsibility of actual persons due to the limited liability benefits of incorporating. All the rights, none of the responsibilities. Even the old arguments that they provided jobs and deserved special treatment because they risked their capital to do so, are no longer valid, since they've continued to export jobs and are always bailed out with taxpayer money when they fail.
So, if you have a life-long anti-corporate crusader like Ralph Nader, and two political parties who oppose him, both parties are obviously exactly what Nader says they are: the corporate parties. And since they both cater to corporations because corporations have more money than ordinary people, they are actually one party--an anti-people party.
A glimmer of hope exists in Arizona and Maine where citizens enacted legislation that provides for publicly-funded elections. This takes corporate money out of the political process and permits candidates to run for and win office without becoming beholden to corporations in the process. Similar legislation just passed the California State Assembly yesterday, but has yet to come before the State Senate for a vote and is subject to revisions and amendments before that can happen. California Common Cause, the Nurses' Union, and other large organizations are pushing for it, but it would also have to be able to get past a certain Schwarzenegger veto.
In places where it is already law, publicly-funded elections allow third party and independent candidates to win office and present a true opposition to the corporate parties. These "clean money" candidates owe their success only to the people who voted for them, and that is who they represent. It is an idea whose time has come, but many other election reforms are needed, such as the abolition of the electoral college, a return to paper ballots, some form of proportional representation, ranked voting, etc., before there can be any real challenge to the corporate duopoly.
Another good one, once you've read Karp, is "Dime's Worth of Difference," by Alexander Cockburn and Jeffrey St. Clair, which updates the story with recent facts. An excellent example they give is how the neo-con/Trilateral/PNAC agenda continued to be advanced during the Clinton administration.
What it boils down to is that the Democrats and Republicans need each other to stay in power, and both are dedicated to eliminating any real political opposition.
Since both parties are beholden to big corporations, they prefer the present form of government in the U.S. where government operates for the benefit of corporations and corporations dictate what government should do. This is exactly the form of government that Mussolini defined as fascist, even though AOL just deleted a post of mine that said so.
The Democrats and the Republicans dine at the same trough and neither will ever present any impedence to corporate rule.
Ralph Nader is the greatest anti-corporate crusader the U.S. has ever known. Both Republicans and Democrats joined forces to deny him the right to take part in public debates, to smear him, and to keep him off the ballot wherever possible in the 2000 and 2004 Presidential elections. On the large pro-Democratic forums, nobody is more hated and vilified than Nader--Bush and Cheney don't even come close.
In the U.S. we have a government of the corporations, by the corporations, and for the corporations. Corporations have more rights than citizens, in that they are legally persons but do not have the responsibility of actual persons due to the limited liability benefits of incorporating. All the rights, none of the responsibilities. Even the old arguments that they provided jobs and deserved special treatment because they risked their capital to do so, are no longer valid, since they've continued to export jobs and are always bailed out with taxpayer money when they fail.
So, if you have a life-long anti-corporate crusader like Ralph Nader, and two political parties who oppose him, both parties are obviously exactly what Nader says they are: the corporate parties. And since they both cater to corporations because corporations have more money than ordinary people, they are actually one party--an anti-people party.
A glimmer of hope exists in Arizona and Maine where citizens enacted legislation that provides for publicly-funded elections. This takes corporate money out of the political process and permits candidates to run for and win office without becoming beholden to corporations in the process. Similar legislation just passed the California State Assembly yesterday, but has yet to come before the State Senate for a vote and is subject to revisions and amendments before that can happen. California Common Cause, the Nurses' Union, and other large organizations are pushing for it, but it would also have to be able to get past a certain Schwarzenegger veto.
In places where it is already law, publicly-funded elections allow third party and independent candidates to win office and present a true opposition to the corporate parties. These "clean money" candidates owe their success only to the people who voted for them, and that is who they represent. It is an idea whose time has come, but many other election reforms are needed, such as the abolition of the electoral college, a return to paper ballots, some form of proportional representation, ranked voting, etc., before there can be any real challenge to the corporate duopoly.
Bush, the man, is not winning. The corporate-run system is. Why focus on the man and disregard the real culprits ?
Thanks for the smoke screen, all the same.
Damn.
The system, is functioning perfectly!
You just don't happen to care for the results. (neither do I)
The system, which IS functioning perfectly, will soon balance the other way.
56 million Americans can't be ignored forever!
The amount of progress that the Liberals have made in just one year has been huge!
This time last year the Solid wall that was the Republican machine was solid and invulnerable.
Every single accusation simply rolled off it, no matter how big it was!
Today that wall is absolutely broken, and on the verge of falling in pieces!
The New Republican Party has revealed it's true colors,
and everyone in America is able to see them,
even those who last year refused too!
You just don't happen to care for the results. (neither do I)
The system, which IS functioning perfectly, will soon balance the other way.
56 million Americans can't be ignored forever!
The amount of progress that the Liberals have made in just one year has been huge!
This time last year the Solid wall that was the Republican machine was solid and invulnerable.
Every single accusation simply rolled off it, no matter how big it was!
Today that wall is absolutely broken, and on the verge of falling in pieces!
The New Republican Party has revealed it's true colors,
and everyone in America is able to see them,
even those who last year refused too!
QUOTE(sky of mind @ Tuesday, 7 February 2006, 5:25 am) [snapback]42678[/snapback]
The system, is functioning perfectly!
You just don't happen to care for the results. (neither do I)
The system, which IS functioning perfectly, will soon balance the other way.
56 million Americans can't be ignored forever!
The amount of progress that the Liberals have made in just one year has been huge!
This time last year the Solid wall that was the Republican machine was solid and invulnerable.
Every single accusation simply rolled off it, no matter how big it was!
Today that wall is absolutely broken, and on the verge of falling in pieces!
The New Republican Party has revealed it's true colors,
and everyone in America is able to see them,
even those who last year refused too!
So we get 8 years of Buscho, and the system is running perfectly?
You guys need a new system.
one word ;
http://www.opednews.com/articles/opedne_pa...6_greenwave.htm
okay, one URL.
True Progressives should Decamp asap. The Green are no alternative, at present, but strengthened by a substantial number of ex-Dems, the Greens could evolve to the point of being a true oppostional Party. This may go against the grain of backers of the two-party system, but as I see it, the only chance we have is to build a real opposition from the bottom up. Names are unimportant, policies and platforms are most important. Universal Healthcare & Work Security ( see coalmine XYZ ) are two things I believe are in dire need of attention.
http://www.opednews.com/articles/opedne_pa...6_greenwave.htm
okay, one URL.
True Progressives should Decamp asap. The Green are no alternative, at present, but strengthened by a substantial number of ex-Dems, the Greens could evolve to the point of being a true oppostional Party. This may go against the grain of backers of the two-party system, but as I see it, the only chance we have is to build a real opposition from the bottom up. Names are unimportant, policies and platforms are most important. Universal Healthcare & Work Security ( see coalmine XYZ ) are two things I believe are in dire need of attention.
QUOTE(JayHawk @ Tuesday, 7 February 2006, 2:25 am) [snapback]42790[/snapback]
one word ;
http://www.opednews.com/articles/opedne_pa...6_greenwave.htm
okay, one URL.
True Progressives should Decamp asap. The Green are no alternative, at present, but strengthened by a substantial number of ex-Dems, the Greens could evolve to the point of being a true oppostional Party. This may go against the grain of backers of the two-party system, but as I see it, the only chance we have is to build a real opposition from the bottom up. Names are unimportant, policies and platforms are most important. Universal Healthcare & Work Security ( see coalmine XYZ ) are two things I believe are in dire need of attention.
A third party at this time Absolutley does Not help us dethrone the Republicans.
A third party would be exactly what they would want.
QUOTE
A third party at this time Absolutley does Not help us dethrone the Republicans.
A third party would be exactly what they would want.
A third party would be exactly what they would want.
One party is what they want. ONE PARTY! Never forget they do not want a system that allows more then one view point to have. The more different views that surround something, the more it grows.
QUOTE(MasterMind @ Tuesday, 7 February 2006, 5:56 pm) [snapback]42812[/snapback]
One party is what they want. ONE PARTY! Never forget they do not want a system that allows more then one view point to have. The more different views that surround something, the more it grows.
Bingo ! Absolutely correct MasterMind. One big happy Party. They've been doing one hellofa job of
disguising the two as two seperate parties. I assume the amount of effort and financing channeled
into keeping the public in the belief they are two seperate parties.....is immense. Immense is more
likely an understatement. The greatest effort of all is being made along these lines ......by both the
Democrats and the Republicans AND, last but still in charge of the country.....BIG CORP.
There's a lot of info available on "Left Gatekeeping" ( Left Gatekeepers ). Anyone who doubts
what I've attempted to point out should review the facts. Why on earth people on the ground,
at the grass-roots level are actively participating in the Left Gatekeeping scheme.....is beyond me.
If they're not being paid for it, they're doing a job for free, a job that directly muffles their very own
freedom.
The Democratic Party is beginning to move as a result of the filibuster fiasco and the voices they've
recently heard coming from the ground / blogosphere. That alone is proof that we need more of the same,
much more of the same : abandenment of support for the left wing of the grand old Party.
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