All you intellectual idealists that choose to either believe what the media says about 911 or continues to say that we dont really know and offer nothing either way, Please watch this video
and as a side note: If you still cannot see through the facts of this video, what is really going on then I can't help you.

Turned out to be less than an hour


Sixteen days and counting.

How come everybody and their little brother that want to believe in conspiracy theory feel they can convert the rest of the obviousely stupid "sheeple" (people who don't see reality as the offended), with yet another movie filled with so called, evidence?

Is it beyond their capacity to understand just how biased thier opinion has become?



It reminds me of a 17 year old. Those of us who are parents know full well about that age of awakening in which our spawn are absolutely convinced they know everything. It's like a big wake up and they have some knowledge. This is brand new to then and it's awesome. Clearly they now know everything. Then they learn a little more, and become even more convinced that NOW they know all there is to know about everything!


A year ago I was becoming tired of all the conspiracy theory and I reached my breaking point over the idea of government weather control programs and Chemtrails. One guy actually posted a picture taken out the window of the airplane that showed a missle being shot into the eye wall of a hurricane. Problem was the so called "missle" was actually a light inside the plane reflected on the window! And the idea that the government is actively and deliberately trying to poison it's entire population with chemtrails? (Lets not even get into the idea that black ops blew the levies in New Orleans so that Haliburton could get to the oil under the city)



More and more I become cynical, because 99% of all the so called "9/11 conspiracy" is just plain old bull shit, and I for one will choose to refuse to be manipulated by those who wish to spread disinformation.

Don't talk to me about a sky tower that falls to the ground in 8 second, UNLESS you can provide scientific evidence that PROVES your claim. I don't want anymore testimonials from self described experts that think they see something in film, or think they understand physics enough even without formal training to make a claim about the physics of a thing.



Are there conspiracies active in the world today?
Very likely yes, but right now I don't give a rats ass.

I know I know sky Lee harvey oswald blew the back of kennedy's head out from the front, we went to war in Iraq because Saddam was responsible for 911 oh wait no it was because he was in cohoots with bin ladin oh wait no it was because the had weapons of mass destruction. Oh and we have all seen steel buildings collapse due to fire right? And of course we all seen the plane hit the pentagon and the plane parts in shanksville. Your right sky there is no conspiracy. LOL
Better yet dont come to me with your non-theories unless you come to me with some facts that 911 happened the way they said it happened. In a court of law the prosecutor has to provide evidence of the crime not the accused.

Over the top dude, way over the top.

What, left overs again?
If it's good once, it's even better twice?

Oh boy, more conspiracy theories. How deep is this so called "conspiracy" now? My god, this is the most complicated thing in the universe. I was able to follow the ins and outs of organic chemistry easier than these theories. There were no planes you say? Oh there were planes but they were piloted by remote controls. No wait, there were planes and then those planes were brought to secret bases and new planes were used and everyone who was aboard the first planes were really alive. Better yet, a plane hit the pentagon but was followed by a cruse missile. There is no way that one of the largest planes on earth, filled with jet fuel, and crashing at top speed into a building could possibly have caused it to fall down. No, it is much more likely that tens of thousands of pounds of explosives were brought into each building (and surrounding buildings mind you) in secret and put on all of the support structures while not a soul noticed. Then the military took their secret planes and crashed them (or maybe not) into the world trade center. Then, the most complicated, illogical plan in human history goes off without a hitch.

Then, all we have to do is get tens of thousands of people to keep their mouths' shut, get bin laden (or an actor dressed like bin laden) to admit he did, and make bush seem like a total retard who couldn't tie his shoes, let alone pull off the greatest con in the history of all time, and now we can invade iraq. God damn, that is the answer, that makes perfect sense. It was all so simple, even a person with no knowledge about aircraft, engineering, national security, international affairs, jet fuel, muslim extremist, the scientific method or dare i say, logic, could see this as the truth.

Thanks Jim, it feels good to know the truth. I just hope the government doesn't came after me, now that i know one of the most damaging secrets in united states history.





You mean this is your last attempt at this? What a damn shame.

This is the second time you've mentioned that. So tell us, what makes you think this is a court of law? POAC's black robe?

Oh he's trying to imply that he has the moral high ground in these conspiracy theory postings.

This is America. Anyone is allowed to say just about anything, no matter how outrageous.
However, because it IS America, I'm also free to tell you it's bull shit!
And as much as I have to allow you the right to express yourself, you also have to allow me the very same right.




You want conspiracy theory? Really?
Well here's my conspiracy theory.

98% of ALL the current batch of 9/11 conspiracy theories are nothing more than PNAC, Neo-Con Republican disinformation designed specifically to confuse and fog the real issue. The attempt it to dilute the real 9/11 secrets that our government is not telling us, with so much bull shit and out right bunk, that nobody gives a damn any longer. So much disinformation that anytime anyone mentions anything about all the real things the Government is still not talking about, nobody will listen. To put out so much pure 9/11 hogwash that it ALL gets branded as being hog wash, and the "official version" becomes by default, the accepted version. Proof? Now yer all even dragging the Kennedy assignation into the mess from 45 years ago. Why stop there? Lets talk bay of pigs, pearl harbor, the attempted coup on Roosevelt, the Spanish American war in the Philippines, chem trails, weather control, New Orleans, my next door neighbor that looks kinda weird and always keeps his curtains closed!

If yer gonna continue to go here, lets get into the whole god damned enchilada. Then we can be done with it and allow us to focus on REALITY for a while.


Oh, and by the way, Project Blue Book was a cover for the fact that our government was in secret negotiations with Aliens from another planet in another star system. Also, Van Daniken was killed (Made to look like he died of natural causes) because he discovered the truth about these extra terrestrial "visitors" written on the walls of Mayan ruins.

The problem with arguing about conspiracy theorist is that there is never an end. It doesn't matter how right the person arguing with the conspiracy theorist is, they always have a silver bullet, something that will get them out of any corner is "that is what they want you to believe". I say bush and co. is too dumb to pull off anything like 9/11 and you can see that in anything that they do. Katrina, Iraq, Afghanistan, and anything else they try turns into a cluster fuck, so how could they pull off 9/11? "That is part of their plan. They want you think they are too stupid to pull it off." How about the fact that while burning jet fuel can't melt steel, it can greatly weaken it, and the towers could easily have fallen down that way? "That is just what they want you to believe." How about the fact that airplane debris was found at the pentagon? "That is what they want you to believe. They just planted it there after the missile hit."

More theories explain away problems with the original theories and that is how it will always work. Logic flies out the window along with science and it all seems to make sense from their prospectives. "If they are evil enough to plan 9/11, then what is stopping them from planting evidence at the pentagon? If they are willing to plant evidence at the pentagon, then what is stopping them from making fake bin laden tapes? If they make fake bin laden tapes, what is stopping them from sending anthrax? If they are willing to send anthrax, what is stopping them from......."

It will never end because they have made up their minds that the least likely and most complicated story is the correct one. Then if you are willing to believe something that unlikely to begin with, then there is nothing stopping you from adding more layers.

Here is what i have been waiting for. On real time last night, bill maher had a new rule about conspiracy theories. Includes video and transcript.

http://rawstory.com//news/2007/Bill_Maher_...hould_0915.html

It's much easier to destroy something (or allow it to be destroyed) than to build something. What they're doing in Iraq is nation building, and it's not working because the people there don't want a US nation. If all they wanted to do was to destroy Iraq, the troops would have been home in 2003.

"The world is governed by very different personages from what is imagined by those who are not
behind the scenes." --Prime Minister Benjamin Disraeli of England, in 1844.

"The Council on Foreign Relations (CFR) is the American Branch of a society which originated in England ... (and) ... believes national boundaries should be obliterated and one-world rule
established."-- Professor of History Carroll Quigley, Georgetown University, in his book "Tragedy and Hope".

"Some of the biggest men in the United States, in the field of commerce and manufacture, are afraid of something. They know that there is a power somewhere so organized, so subtle, so watchful, so interlocked, so complete, so pervasive, that they had better not speak above their breath when they speak in condemnation of it." - Woodrow Wilson

"[The New World Order] cannot happen without U.S. participation, as we are the most
significant single component. Yes, there will be a New World Order, and it will force the United
States to change it's perceptions." -- Henry Kissenger, World Affairs Council Press Conference,
Regent Beverly Wilshire Hotel , April 19th 1994

"David Rockefeller is the most conspicuous representative today of the ruling class, a multinational fraternity of men who shape the global economy and manage the flow of its capital. Rockefeller was born to it, and he has made the most of it. But what some critics see as a vast international conspiracy, he considers a circumstance of life and justanother day's work... In the world of David Rockefeller it's hard to tell where business ends and politics begins" . Bill Moyers

"We know in the not too distant future, a half dozen corporations are going to control the media.
We took this step (merger) to ensure we were one of them"--Time Warner spokesperson.

"We shall have World Government, whether or not we like it. The only question is whether
World Government will be achieved by conquest or consent." -- Statement made before the
United States Senate on Feb. 7, 1950 by James Paul Warburg ("Angel" to and active in the
United World Federalists), son of Paul Moritz Warburg, nephew of Felix Warburg and of Jacob
Schiff, both of Kuhn, Loeb & Co. which poured millions into the Russian Revolution through
James' brother Max, banker to the German government - See the Siss?on Report

"All of us will ultimately be judged on the effort we have contributed to building a NEW WORLD ORDER."--Robert Kennedy, former U.S. Attorney-General, 1967.

"The real rulers in Washington are invisible and exercise their power from behind the
scenes."-- Justice Felix Frankfurter, U.S. Supreme Court.

"I am concerned for the security of our great nation; not so much because of any threat from without, but because of the insideous forces working from within." -- General Douglas MacArthur

"For some time I have been disturbed by the way the CIA has been diverted from it's original
assignment. It has become an operational and at times a policy making arm of the government." --
President Harry Truman

"The real truth of the matter is, as you and I know, that a financial element in the large centers has owned the government of the U.S. since the days of Andrew Jackson."-- U.S. President Franklin D. Roosevelt in a letter written Nov. 21, 1933 to Colonel E. Mandell House.

"The real menace of our Republic is the invisible government which like a giant octopus sprawls
its slimy legs over our cities, states and nation."-- Mayor (1918-1925) John F. Hylan of New York.

"Fundamental Bible-believing people do not have the right to indoctrinate their children in their
religious beliefs because we, the state, are preparing them for the year 2000, when America will be
part of a one-world global society and their children will not fit in." --Nebraska State Senator Peter Hoagland, speaking on radio in 1983.

"When we got organized as a country and we wrote a fairly radical Constitution with a radical
Bill of Rights, giving a radical amount of freedom to Americans..." "And so alot of people say there's
too much personal freedom. When personal freedom's being abused, you have to move to limit it.
That's what we did in the announcement I made last weekend on the Housing Projects, about how
we're going to have weapon sweeps and more things like that to try to make the people feel safer
in their communities"--President Bill Clinton 3-22-94, MTV's "Enough is Enough"

"We can't be so fixated on our desire to preserve the rights of ordinary Americans.."--
Bill Clinton USA Today--3-11-93, page 2a

"Gun registration is not enough"--Attorney Generral Janet Reno--12-10-93--Associated Press

"Waiting periods are only a step. Registration is only a step. The prohibition of private firearms
is the goal"--Janet Reno

"If a nation values anything more than freedom, then it will lose it's freedom; and the irony of it is
that if it is comfort and security that it values, it will lose that too.Unknown Americans must decide :
Are we to be governed by Americans or by an International organization ? I, for one, owe no
alliegence to the United Nations nor will I give it any. I obey only the U.S. Constitution. You had
better think about this issue, for if the U.N. can violate the Sovereignty of Haiti, Iraq and other
countries, it can violate ours...The United States may not be the top dog 15 years from now. U.N.
security council resolutions, backed by say chinese soldiers, could be aimed at us."-Charley
Reese-Orlando Sentinel

"We are grateful to the Washington Post, the New York Times, Time magazine and other great
publications whose directors have attended our meetings and respected the promises of discretion
for almost forty years. It would have been impossible for us to develop our plan for the world if
we had been subject to the bright lights of publicity during those years. But, the world is now more
sophisticated and prepared to march towards a world-government. The supranational sovereignty
of an intellectual elite and world bankers is surely preferable to the National autodetermination
practiced in past centuries"--David Rockefeller in an address to a Trilateral Commission meeting
in June of 1991

"From the days of Sparticus, Weishaupt, Karl Marx, Trotski, belacoon, Rosa Luxenberg and
Ema Goldman, this world conspiracy has been steadily growing. This conspiracy played a definite
recognizable role in the French Revolution. It has been the mainspring of every subversive movement
during the 19th century. And now at last, this band of extraordinary personalities from the under-
world of the great cities of Europe and America have gripped the Russian people by the hair of their
head and have become the undisputed masters of that enormous empire."--Winston Churchill to
the London press in 1922.

"The Trilateral Commission is intended to be the vehicle for multinational consolidation of the
commercial and banking interests by seizing control of the political government of the United States.
The Trilateral Commission represents a skillful, coordinated effort to seize control and consolidate
the four centers of power--Political, Monetary, Intellectual, and Ecclesiastical."--U.S. Senator
Barry Goldwater from his 1964 book "No Apologies"

"I believe that if the people of this nation fully understood what Congress has done to them over the last 49 years, they would move on Washington; they would not wait for an election....It adds up
to a preconceived plan to destroy the economic and social independence of the United States!"
--George W. Malone, U.S. Senator (Nevada), speaking before Congress in1957.

"The invisible Money Power is working to control and enslave mankind. It financed
Communism, Fascism, Marxism, Zionism, Socialism. All of these are directed to making the United
States a member of a World Government ..." -- AMERICAN MERCURY MAGAZINE, December 1957, pg. 92.

"The Air Force is suffering from pilots who have lost faith in their generals, jet engines that still
don't work after repairs and maintenance depots with 'little quality or quantity of work being
produced', according to an internal Defense Department memorandum. The draft memo paints a
troubling picture of the state of American air power. 'The sad state of air-force readiness can be
blamed on the Clinton Administration, which treats the military as a toy to be deployed for
meals-on-wheels-type missionswithout due consideration for it's impact on readiness", said Robert
Maginnis, a retired Army Lieutenent colonel and an analyst at the conservative Family Research
Council

"The International government of the United Nations, stripped of it's legal trimming, then, is
really the International Government of the United States and the Soviet Union acting in Unison."
From the American Jewish Committee's official magazine "Commentary" of Nov. 1958, Pg. 376

"War to the hilt between communism and capitalism is inevidable. Today of course, we are not
strong enough to attack. Our time will come in 20 or 30 years...The Bourgeoisie will have to be
put to sleep. So we shall begin by launching the most spectacular peace movement on record.
There will be electrifying overtures and unheard of concessions. The capitalist countries, stupid
and decadent, will rejoice to cooperate in their own destruction. They will leap at another chance
to be friends. As soon as their guard is down, we shall smash them with our clentched fist."
Dimitry Z. Manuilsky in a speech made in 1931 before the Lenin School of Political Warfare.
(He became an officer of the U.N. Security Council in 1949)

"We must realize that we cannot co-exist eternally. One of us must go to his grave. We do not
want to go to the grave. They do not want to go to the grave, either. So what can be done? We
must push them to their grave." -- Sewren Bailer, a polish communist leader, who defected to the
west, charged that in April, 1955 Khrushchev said this to a group of Warsaw Communists.

"We operate here under directives which emulate (sic) from the White House ... The substance of
the directives under which we operate is that we shall use our grant making power to alter life in the
United States so that we can comfortably be merged with the Soviet Union." -- Rowan Gaither, President of the Ford Foundation, 1954.

"The old world order changed when this war-storm broke. The old international order passed away as
suddenly, as unexpectedly, and as completely as if it had been wiped out by a gigantic flood, by a great
tempest, or by a volcanic eruption. The old world order died with the setting of that day's sun and a new
world order is being born while I speak, with birth-pangs so terrible that it seems almost incredible that life
could come out of such fearful suffering and such overwhelming sorrow." -- Nicholas Murray Butler, in
an address delivered before the Union League of Philadelphia, Nov. 27, 1915

"The peace conference has assembled. It will make the most momentous decisions in history, and upon
these decisions will rest the stability of the new world order and the future peace of the world." -- M. C.
Alexander, Executive Secretary of the American Association for International Conciliation, in a
subscription letter for the periodical International Conciliation (1919)

"If there are those who think we are to jump immediately into a new world order, actuated by complete
understanding and brotherly love, they are doomed to disappointment. If we are ever to approach that
time, it will be after patient and persistent effort of long duration. The present international situation of
mistrust and fear can only be corrected by a formula of equal status, continuously applied, to every phase
of international contacts, until the cobwebs of the old order are brushed out of the minds of the people of
all lands." -- Dr. Augustus O. Thomas, president of the World Federation of Education Associations
(August 1927), quoted in the book "International Understanding: Agencies Educating for a New World"
(1931)

"... when the struggle seems to be drifting definitely towards a world social democracy, there may still be
very great delays and disappointments before it becomes an efficient and beneficent world system.
Countless people ... will hate the new world order ... and will die protesting against it. When we attempt
to evaluate its promise, we have to bear in mind the distress of a generation or so of malcontents, many of
them quite gallant and graceful-looking people." -- H. G. Wells, in his book entitled "The New World
Order" (1939)

"The term Internationalism has been popularized in recent years to cover an interlocking financial,
political, and economic world force for the purpose of establishing a World Government. Today
Internationalism is heralded from pulpit and platform as a 'League of Nations' or a 'Federated Union' to
which the United States must surrender a definite part of its National Sovereignty. The World
Government plan is being advocated under such alluring names as the 'New International Order,' 'The
New World Order,' 'World Union Now,' 'World Commonwealth of Nations,' 'World Community,' etc. All
the terms have the same objective; however, the line of approach may be religious or political according
to the taste or training of the individual." -- excerpt from A Memorial to be Addressed to the House of
Bishops and the House of Clerical and Lay Deputies of the Protestant Episcopal Church in General
Convention (October 1940)

"In the first public declaration on the Jewish question since the outbreak of the war, Arthur Greenwood,
member without portfolio in the British War Cabinet, assured the Jews of the United States that when
victory was achieved an effort would be made to found a new world order based on the ideals of 'justice
and peace.'" -- excerpt from article entitled "New World Order Pledged to Jews," in the New York Times
(October 1940)

"If totalitarianism wins this conflict, the world will be ruled by tyrants, and individuals will be slaves. If
democracy wins, the nations of the earth will be united in a commonwealth of free peoples, and
individuals, wherever found, will be the sovereign units of the new world order." -- The Declaration of the
Federation of the World, produced by the Congress on World Federation, adopted by the Legislatures of
North Carolina (1941), New Jersey (1942), Pennsylvania (1943), and possibly other states.

"New World Order Needed for Peace: State Sovereignty Must Go, Declares Notre Dame Professor" --
title of article in The Tablet (Brooklyn) (March 1942)

"Undersecretary of State Sumner Welles tonight called for the early creation of an international
organization of anti-Axis nations to control the world during the period between the armistice at the end of
the present war and the setting up of a new world order on a permanent basis." -- text of article in the
Philadelphia Inquirer (June 1942)

"The statement went on to say that the spiritual teachings of religion must become the foundation for the
new world order and that national sovereignty must be subordinate to the higher moral law of God." --
American Institute of Judaism, excerpt from article in the New York Times (December 1942)

"There are some plain common-sense considerations applicable to all these attempts at world planning.
They can be briefly stated: 1. To talk of blueprints for the future or building a world order is, if properly
understood, suggestive, but it is also dangerous. Societies grow far more truly than they are built. A
constitution for a new world order is never like a blueprint for a skyscraper." -- Norman Thomas, in his
book "What Is Our Destiny" (1944)

"He [John Foster Dulles] stated directly to me that he had every reason to believe that the Governor
[Thomas E. Dewey of New York] accepts his point of view and that he is personally convinced that this
is the policy that he would promote with great vigor if elected. So it is fair to say that on the first round
the Sphinx of Albany has established himself as a prima facie champion of a strong and definite new
world order." -- excerpt from article by Ralph W. Page in the Philadelphia Bulletin (May 1944)

"The United Nations, he told an audience at Harvard University, 'has not been able--nor can it be able--to
shape a new world order which events so compellingly demand.' ... The new world order that will answer
economic, military, and political problems, he said, 'urgently requires, I believe, that the United States
take the leadership among all free peoples to make the underlying concepts and aspirations of national
sovereignty truly meaningful through the federal approach.'" -- Gov. Nelson Rockefeller of New York, in
an article entitled "Rockefeller Bids Free Lands Unite: Calls at Harvard for Drive to Build New World
Order" -- New York Times (February 1962)

"The developing coherence of Asian regional thinking is reflected in a disposition to consider problems
and loyalties in regional terms, and to evolve regional approaches to development needs and to the
evolution of a new world order." -- Richard Nixon, in Foreign Affairs (October 1967)

"He [President Nixon] spoke of the talks as a beginning, saying nothing more about the prospects for
future contacts and merely reiterating the belief he brought to China that both nations share an interest in
peace and building 'a new world order.'" -- excerpt from an article in the New York Times (February
1972)

"If instant world government, Charter review, and a greatly strengthened International Court do not
provide the answers, what hope for progress is there? The answer will not satisfy those who seek simple
solutions to complex problems, but it comes down essentially to this: The hope for the foreseeable lies,
not in building up a few ambitious central institutions of universal membership and general jurisdiction as
was envisaged at the end of the last war, but rather in the much more decentralized, disorderly and
pragmatic process of inventing or adapting institutions of limited jurisdiction and selected membership to
deal with specific problems on a case-by-case basis ... In short, the 'house of world order' will have to be
built from the bottom up rather than from the top down. It will look like a great 'booming, buzzing
confusion,' to use William James' famous description of reality, but an end run around national
sovereignty, eroding it piece by piece, will accomplish much more than the old-fashioned frontal assault."
-- Richard N. Gardner, in Foreign Affairs (April 1974)

"The existing order is breaking down at a very rapid rate, and the main uncertainty is whether mankind
can exert a positive role in shaping a new world order or is doomed to await collapse in a passive posture.
We believe a new order will be born no later than early in the next century and that the death throes of
the old and the birth pangs of the new will be a testing time for the human species." -- Richard A. Falk, in
an article entitled "Toward a New World Order: Modest Methods and Drastic Visions," in the book "On
the Creation of a Just World Order" (1975)

"My country's history, Mr. President, tells us that it is possible to fashion unity while cherishing diversity,
that common action is possible despite the variety of races, interests, and beliefs we see here in this
chamber. Progress and peace and justice are attainable. So we say to all peoples and governments: Let us
fashion together a new world order." -- Henry Kissinger, in address before the General Assembly of the
United Nations, October 1975)

"At the old Inter-American Office in the Commerce Building here in Roosevelt's time, as Assistant
Secretary of State for Latin American Affairs under President Truman, as chief whip with Adlai
Stevenson and Tom Finletter at the founding of the United Nations in San Francisco, Nelson Rockefeller
was in the forefront of the struggle to establish not only an American system of political and economic
security but a new world order." -- part of article in the New York Times (November 1975)

"A New World Order" -- title of article on commencement address at the University of Pennsylvania by
Hubert H. Humphrey, printed in the Pennsylvania Gazette (June 1977)

"Further global progress is now possible only through a quest for universal consensus in the movement
towards a new world order." -- Mikhail Gorbachev, in an address at the United Nations (December 1988)

"We believe we are creating the beginning of a new world order coming out of the collapse of the
U.S.-Soviet antagonisms." -- Brent Scowcroft (August 1990), quoted in the Washington Post (May 1991)

"We can see beyond the present shadows of war in the Middle East to a new world order where the
strong work together to deter and stop aggression. This was precisely Franklin Roosevelt's and Winston
Churchill's vision for peace for the post-war period." -- Richard Gephardt, in the Wall Street Journal
(September 1990)

"If we do not follow the dictates of our inner moral compass and stand up for human life, then his
lawlessness will threaten the peace and democracy of the emerging new world order we now see, this long
dreamed-of vision we've all worked toward for so long." -- President George Bush (January 1991)

"But it became clear as time went on that in Mr. Bush's mind the New World Order was founded on a
convergence of goals and interests between the U.S. and the Soviet Union, so strong and permanent that
they would work as a team through the U.N. Security Council." -- excerpt from A. M. Rosenthal, in the
New York Times (January 1991)

"I would support a Presidential candidate who pledged to take the following steps: ... At the end of the
war in the Persian Gulf, press for a comprehensive Middle East settlement and for a 'new world order'
based not on Pax Americana but on peace through law with a stronger U.N. and World Court." -- George
McGovern, in the New York Times (February 1991)

"... it's Bush's baby, even if he shares its popularization with Gorbachev. Forget the Hitler 'new order'
root; F.D.R. used the phrase earlier." -- William Safire, in the New York Times (February 1991)

"How I Learned to Love the New World Order" -- article by Sen. Joseph R. Biden, Jr. in the Wall Street
Journal (April 1992)

"How to Achieve The New World Order" -- title of book excerpt by Henry Kissinger, in Time magazine
(March 1994)

"The Final Act of the Uruguay Round, marking the conclusion of the most ambitious trade negotiation of
our century, will give birth - in Morocco - to the World Trade Organization, the third pillar of the New
World Order, along with the United Nations and the International Monetary Fund." -- part of full-page
advertisement by the government of Morocco in the New York Times (April 1994)

"New World Order: The Rise of the Region-State" -- title of article by Kenichi Ohmae, political reform
leader in Japan, in the Wall Street Journal (August 1994)

The "new world order that is in the making must focus on the creation of a world of democracy, peace
and prosperity for all." -- Nelson Mandela, in the Philadelphia Inquirer (October 1994)

The renewal of the nonproliferation treaty was described as important "for the welfare of the whole world
and the new world order." -- President Hosni Mubarak of Egypt, in the New York Times (April 1995)

"Alchemy for a New World Order" -- article by Stephen John Stedman in Foreign Affairs (May/June
1995)

"We are not going to achieve a new world order without paying for it in blood as well as in words and
money." -- Arthur Schlesinger, Jr., in Foreign Affairs (July/August 1995)

YOUR RIGHT AS ALWAYS SKY
There is no conspiracy, None of these people think so either....
You and I are a nobody in their eyes. The only way to REALLY change things is first and foremost understanding what has to be changed. If the issues are controlled by an elite power, to solve the issues people you have to become intellectually aware of why the issues are there in the first place. I recommend you read Morals and Dogma by Albert Pike. Then and only then will you understand why we are in Iraq and then you will realize what the next phase of this war entails. There are far more people in this country who are aware of the truth than ME. There are people who have spent all of their lives attempting to expose these criminals.

Mike Berger:degree in Sociology with a focus on human motivation
W. David Kubiak:taught mass media and memetics at Ritsumeikan University
Bryan Sacks: teaches philosophy at the University of Rutgers-Camden and Immaculata University.
Matt Sullivan:Trained in Chemistry at the University of Delaware he worked as a R&D engineer at HP before taking graduate training in chemistry at the University of Texas
Fred Burks:US State Department in 2004
Steven E. Jones B.S. in Physics, Mathematics minor, magna cum laude with honors, from Brigham Young University in 1973, retaining the Presidential (David O. McKay) Scholarship; Ph.D. in Physics, Mathematics/Electronics minors from Vanderbilt University in 1978, retaining full Tuition Scholarship and Research Fellowship (1973-1978); Ph.D. research conducted at the Stanford Linear Accelerator Center (1974-1977); course work completed at Stanford University; Post-doctoral research conducted at Cornell University (CESR) and the Los Alamos Meson Physics Facility; Conducted research at the Idaho National Engineering Laboratory, 1979-1985 (Senior Engineering Specialist); Principal Investigator for experimental muon-catalyzed fusion 1982-1991 for the U.S. Department of Energy, Division of Advanced Energy Projects; Spokesman for LAMPF Experiment #727 and co-spokesman for LAMPF Experiments #963 and #1151 (1982 - 1993); Collaborator in several other experiments, including experiments at TRIUMF (Vancouver, Canada), The National High Energy Laboratory, KEK (Tsukuba, Japan), Rutherford-Appleton Laboratory (Oxford, U.K.), and Kamioka, Japan; Associate Director, Brigham Young University Center for Fusion Studies, 1989-1994 Professor of Physics (retired 2007).
Dr. Faiz Khan:served as a triage doctor at ground zero, and is on the staff of Long Island Jewish Medical Center in Hillside, Queens. He is a member of the Board of Directors of the ASMA Society for Islamic Spirituality and serves as the Assistant Imam at the al-Farah Mosque in Manhattan and at the Islamic Center of Long Island. He has served as a panelist for the United Nations Committee of Religious Non-governmental Organizations and for the New Seminary's Interfaith Retreat on Spiritual Balance.
NOW SKY, This is a small list of people involved in the 911 truth movement, The have credentials DO YOU?

I don't have to have credentials. I'm a skeptic and a citizen. I'm one of those that has to be convinced,
and at least my my case, you fail.


Though I have to admit being flattered that you consider my opinion that important to you that you went to this great length and posted what my be the single longest post on all of the White Rose Forums.

Indeed, that makes me very powerful.

The reason for the credentials comment was because you have criticized research into 911 saying basically that they don't have the intellectual capacity to investigate their claims. I can back all that I say up on here. I've researched this stuff since around '92. I had a research site up and running back then called America in Crises that suddenly disappeared. You can still find it archived through the wayback machine. I helped start a political chat room on paltalk called we the people that eventually ended up becoming a political organization, you can find it here I fought the Hyvee Corp. locally when they forced residents out of a neighborhood (though the people were forced to leave we managed to establish a fair compensation price for their property) I'm no newbie to the political structure and what is going on in America.
I'll stop there with the about me garbage. The bottom line is, like you I want change in America. Where we differ is in viewing what has taken place in America and How the change should occur. I adher to no political party. Sometimes I sound like a democrat, sometimes I sound like a republican. I believe that BOTH parties are guilty of circumventing our liberties equally.
That's me!!!

And I'm saying that as one of the peons in the machine, I'm over whelmed by the sheer quantity of conspiracy theory, as well as the amount that is quite clearly garbage, which colors all of it in garbare colors.

I have said it before and will repeate myself, again.
There is reason for conspiracy theory and some of it may well have basis in truth.
However, too much of it and any that proves to be hooey, harms any proper investigation on other theories.
Convincing those who want to believe is easy, now convince the rest of us skeptics.
(Hint) so far you don't get it no matter how clearly I state it. Another movie or a page of quotes isn't the answer.

Speaking as a conspiracy theorist myself I can safely say that.... Sky's right. The waters have been polluted by so much BS.
That aside, forcing ones beliefs down another's throat only makes the other resentful and unwilling to hear what you have to say.
If 9.11 truth seekers keep on plowing away at this thing, then eventually the truth will come out. The danger is that when that truth does emerge the damage issuing from that one day will already have been done, so it will be relegated to the history books IMHO.
But until then speak to those with ears to hear, or share new information as and when it emerges, but don't try to ram your truth down the throats of skeptics... It's that teaching a pig to sing thing (see Jubal's signature), it just doesn't work.
I think also, approaching a subject like this, one really ought to show a little respect to those one wishes to sway... No?

No wonder no one respects you. You cant even spell the name of your website right!

Additional danger karen, is that when that truth comes out, they won't accept it because the true nature of the conspiracy may not be as fantastic as they expect, and it's rejected. (Can you say, JFK?)

I don't think any amount of truth will ever put an end to the mountain of conspiracy theories. They will continue for many decades, and "New Evidence" will have book publishers in the green for a very, very long time.

And in my opinion, that's exactly what "they" wanted to happen.
Many aspects and the true nature and many real events of 9/11 will forever remain hidden behind a massive smoke screen.

I don't ever bash on anybody because of their spelling.
As long as I can understand what they are trying to express.

Even if the title of the book is badly misspelled, it's the contents of that book which matter.

Trashing someone for bad spelling on line, is a bit like teasing them for dressing poorly in real life.
How a person dresses has nothing to do with intelligence, awareness or the ability to express themselves.


FYI, I am a terrible typist, and often times miss spell words even though I know how to spell just fine.
Firefox has spell check built in and I have a plug in for IE that is also a major protection against spelling nazi's.

So, a person whose basic tenet is that the authorities are lying, manipulative conspirators is trying to ice Sky of Mind out of the debate based on... the authorities (who hand out credentials).

...a cunning plan.....

Look I have a few books sitting right here that maybe would help show people what is really going on I'll list them here:
Global Tyranny step by step by william Jasper
TOward a new world order by Donald Mcalvany
What every American should know about who's really running the world by Melissa Rossi
Maybe these books could help in this forum
Sorry I read a lot

Look, my dad read all of Von Danekins books.
That doesn't mean the theory had any credibility.

If 20 more people wrote conspiracy books, does that give it 20x more credibility?
Just because somebody put it into print, or made a movie, (and movies are never about fantasy) you believe it?

Most of us accept that there is some conspiracy out there, and few of us are denying it.
Speaking for myself I'm only asking that we focus on the truly credible, provable and worthwhile.
Otherwise all we effectively do is to fog over ALL the theories, even those most glaring.

See, I'm a skeptic. But I am here listening to all of it.
The people you have to convince are the vast majority that won't even listen. And as long as you spout what THEY perceive as being junk, (Paranoid, delusional, fantasy) you're spinning your conspiracy wheels because it makes YOU feel good.

SKY SKY SKY
If you dis-credit everything wrote then what the hell do you believe? I realize that in your own little psychotic drug-induced world no one is right but you. But believe it or not there are bad people in this world who rule over us.
And what's provable? only the posts that you put on here? Your credability is being based on democratic strategists. The reason I opted out of arguing over the homosexual/abortion thing was because I couldn't find any credible source that would provide non-biased data. I could have pulled out all kinds of things put out by the christian right but I don't want my religious beliefs to be the fundamental aspect of my postings. The truth is sky, I placed documents on here put out by the Council of foreign relations, the constitution, laws, EO's, Signing statements and it doesn't matter because YOU will always discedit the source in your own mind. THAT IS CLOSEMINDEDNESS Im at least open to others opinions. Sure I don't agree with you but I have never discredited your source of information unless it was provable otherwise.

In short, Brew dood, get over it. If you feel strongly about your case, then fuck me and my opinion.
Your crap will fly, or it won't! I stated my skepticism, and THAT will fly, or it won't!
No one has been paid off, and no one has any obligation to agree with anything I state. I'd be very upset to find out this was the case. I DEPEND on open honesty. If the people around me are not fully honest, I might have an incorrect opinion, or make a bad decision. If I'm wrong I fully expect the members of this board to full on let me know, and believe me, they do.

So, what is it really that you are so afraid of? Why is it that you feeling so insecure?
All I have done is post my own ideas. Can't you handle it if I disagree with you? And if I disagree and it's a convincing argument, are you then going to make it something personal?

As I said, I think it's time to get over it.

My point missed exactly!!!

And yet, here you are.


20 other people you could respond too, and here you are!

Sorta shows you how important your ideas and opinions are in the sense that no matter what you type on here I will still fight for your right to say what you feel. However ill-educated it may seem. The truth remains that there is an unseen force in America and perhaps the world that is directing current events toward an unwritten goal. You spend your time searching for that end whilst I know the end and search the ways people are using to accomplish this end. I expose the plan whilst you expose one side of the plan. This is how I know where you stand: You view current events through the eyes of an already establish ideology ie. liberal extremism while I view current events as though the 2 ideologies have already been compromised and are being controlled by those who wish to control the whole world. There is enough documented truth that reveals how all the governments of the world have been taken over by an elite. On a local level there is enough evidence to prove that Iraq has been under American control since Saddam came to power, there is enough evidence that shows in the very least complacency on the part of the Bush administration on 911, there is enough evidence that shows that Bill Clinton is just as much a part of the game as Bush, there is enough evidence that proves Lee Harvey Oswald did not kill Kennedy, there is enough evidence that the OKC bombing did not take place the way the media spinned it, there is enough evidence to show that waco was a massacre that took place by our intelligence agencies, there is enough evidence that links Bush with the Bin Ladin family. You always blow off conspiracy theories but the fact remains that the conspiracy theories only touch the surface of what is really going on. Kennedy was killed because of this non-conspiracy as well as a host of other people in the 60's and 70's who devoted their entire lives to reveal the truth. There are no opinions in this post thee are facts that are being ignored by the majority of Americans because they don't want to challenge themselves to better their society. They'd rather accept what is being told to them than to lose their own livelihoods. Everyday I think about all those who gave their lives so that we could be free only to let a rogue group of the super rich take that freedom away.